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SharpWill28



Joined: 28 Feb 2009
Posts: 245
Location: Fayetteville

PostPosted: Tue, 01.14.14 7:19 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

RandomHero wrote:
You can blame guys and leagues all you want but there hasn't been a club women's team since 2007-08 or something like that (in fact there weren't enough this year for even a mixed team). So women don't even show up when its not league and there aren't men around.


Sara or Andrea or any other lady with an opinion, feel free to tell me I'm wrong, but...

I don't think your point is valid, Casey because you're not acknowledging league as being a starting point for these women. I think league is the start of a lot of men and women's ultimate "careers", so if they aren't enjoying league, why would they ever think of coming out to a more serious ultimate atmosphere?

Chuck wrote:
But seriously - you have nothing to say about the FDA's conclusion that women are half as good as men? I would be irate if I were a lady in our "community", pandered to because Will and K-Do can only see my gender, and not my skill. Granted, maybe a few ladies wish they would get thrown to more.


Charles, I'm not sure how I am pandering to women or why it would be offensive. To say that just because this rule was put into place means we think they are half as good is pretty small minded and taking things a bit literally. It is just extra incentive for guys to throw their way when they may not before and it also just broadcasts an issue the women have felt exists in our community.
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Cam Wow



Joined: 26 Jan 2009
Posts: 369
Location: Faytown

PostPosted: Tue, 01.14.14 8:24 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

Touch? William, touch?.
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Katherine



Joined: 02 May 2007
Posts: 198

PostPosted: Wed, 01.15.14 12:59 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

The women's lottery does a great job addressing the imbalance in the gender ratio, in my experience so far. Turning a negative like short field space into an opportunity to balance playtime is inspired thinking. Playtime is a BIG factor in league enjoyment for me personally. It might suck for the privileged male elite to have to watch during their bye, but as it enables Nick to indulge his keen observations and rapier wit for our collective entertainment it's a win/win.

As for the incentive rule... As a receiver I firmly believe that if you want people to throw to you, you need to get open and catch the disc. I don't think guys are bigger assholes now than they were when women's numbers were up. But league is, absolutely, one of the best ways for people to learn to love Ultimate. This discussion has made me think. As a thrower I can choose to trust my receiver, and give them a chance to succeed. They will be totally hooked. How about if you pull off a girl-to-girl point as a team, then one of your girls can pull the disc. Making opportunities for girls to improve their skills is solid. Thanks to Andria for putting on this women's clinic.
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RandomHero



Joined: 09 Nov 2004
Posts: 1479

PostPosted: Wed, 01.15.14 3:18 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

SharpWill28 wrote:
RandomHero wrote:
You can blame guys and leagues all you want but there hasn't been a club women's team since 2007-08 or something like that (in fact there weren't enough this year for even a mixed team). So women don't even show up when its not league and there aren't men around.


Sara or Andrea or any other lady with an opinion, feel free to tell me I'm wrong, but...

I don't think your point is valid, Casey because you're not acknowledging league as being a starting point for these women. I think league is the start of a lot of men and women's ultimate "careers", so if they aren't enjoying league, why would they ever think of coming out to a more serious ultimate atmosphere?

Chuck wrote:
But seriously - you have nothing to say about the FDA's conclusion that women are half as good as men? I would be irate if I were a lady in our "community", pandered to because Will and K-Do can only see my gender, and not my skill. Granted, maybe a few ladies wish they would get thrown to more.


Charles, I'm not sure how I am pandering to women or why it would be offensive. To say that just because this rule was put into place means we think they are half as good is pretty small minded and taking things a bit literally. It is just extra incentive for guys to throw their way when they may not before and it also just broadcasts an issue's the women have felt exists in our community.


Because league isn't the staying point for most of our players unfortunately... How many of our players who play beyond league were actually introduced to this sport or even get hooked on it based on leagues? not many as far as I can tell.... its been the college teams in the past with helpful recruiting by others along the way but it's people playing tournaments that actually gets then truly "hooked" on this sport and we've created a league atmosphere that's the furthest thing from a tournament type situation (even an easy going tournament plays by USA Ultimate rules)

I just don't think changing rules or extending playing time or any of this stuff is gonna attract new girls to our sport.... the only way to do it is to ask friends invite new people and stay on them about showing up. Give women opportunities to play together outside of leagues and promote the shit out of them .... not make crazy rules for league or blame men for looking off receivers who aren't open, who just happen to be women.
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SharpWill28



Joined: 28 Feb 2009
Posts: 245
Location: Fayetteville

PostPosted: Wed, 01.15.14 3:01 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

RandomHero wrote:
SharpWill28 wrote:
RandomHero wrote:
You can blame guys and leagues all you want but there hasn't been a club women's team since 2007-08 or something like that (in fact there weren't enough this year for even a mixed team). So women don't even show up when its not league and there aren't men around.


Sara or Andrea or any other lady with an opinion, feel free to tell me I'm wrong, but...

I don't think your point is valid, Casey because you're not acknowledging league as being a starting point for these women. I think league is the start of a lot of men and women's ultimate "careers", so if they aren't enjoying league, why would they ever think of coming out to a more serious ultimate atmosphere?

Chuck wrote:
But seriously - you have nothing to say about the FDA's conclusion that women are half as good as men? I would be irate if I were a lady in our "community", pandered to because Will and K-Do can only see my gender, and not my skill. Granted, maybe a few ladies wish they would get thrown to more.


Charles, I'm not sure how I am pandering to women or why it would be offensive. To say that just because this rule was put into place means we think they are half as good is pretty small minded and taking things a bit literally. It is just extra incentive for guys to throw their way when they may not before and it also just broadcasts an issue's the women have felt exists in our community.


Because league isn't the staying point for most of our players unfortunately... How many of our players who play beyond league were actually introduced to this sport or even get hooked on it based on leagues? not many as far as I can tell.... its been the college teams in the past with helpful recruiting by others along the way but it's people playing tournaments that actually gets then truly "hooked" on this sport and we've created a league atmosphere that's the furthest thing from a tournament type situation (even an easy going tournament plays by USA Ultimate rules)

I just don't think changing rules or extending playing time or any of this stuff is gonna attract new girls to our sport.... the only way to do it is to ask friends invite new people and stay on them about showing up. Give women opportunities to play together outside of leagues and promote the shit out of them .... not make crazy rules for league or blame men for looking off receivers who aren't open, who just happen to be women.


I don't care about players who play beyond league. The current goal and what we're trying to do is grow league numbers. There are people who will play league for a long time that may never play a competitive tournament.

I imagine there are a lot of people who stop playing because they don't improve, which is caused by a lot of things. Obviously, we wish we could retain all our players, but we're focusing on women specifically because that is where we have a more significant drop off. These rules are hardly affecting anything that actually matters, but it puts them on the field and could lead to improvement, so why not try them? I just don't see the harm, especially after mostly positive responses from the ladies who partook in the lottery.

The more weeks that go by, the more data we have to see how it is going.
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tease



Joined: 19 Aug 2005
Posts: 1418
Location: in your kitchen

PostPosted: Wed, 01.15.14 8:26 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

League is what hooked me. Lookin' at all dat hot aaaaaaass to tap. College was the cherry on the cake and forced me to become a better player more quickly.
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Monster



Joined: 06 Apr 2003
Posts: 2946

PostPosted: Thu, 01.16.14 12:42 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

tease wrote:
League is what hooked me. Lookin' at all dat hot aaaaaaass to tap.


I also remember when you were 18.
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Earl



Joined: 10 Nov 2009
Posts: 66

PostPosted: Thu, 01.16.14 11:08 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

Got a question, I.e. Solomon
If he was to catch a point from a lady would it be a "make it, take it" situation?
He is 12 years old. My thought is, until you are in High School, you play as a lady during coed games.
GO GREEN!!!
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kdoe



Joined: 06 Apr 2003
Posts: 2090

PostPosted: Thu, 01.16.14 2:17 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

I know we have a kid that is in middle school that counts as a girl. I think Jody counts Aidan(sp?) as a girl as well. So ya until highschool sounds good to me.

What's highschool now? 9th grade or 10th grade?
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Cam Wow



Joined: 26 Jan 2009
Posts: 369
Location: Faytown

PostPosted: Thu, 01.16.14 3:26 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

Fayetteville High starts at 10th grade but they're technically a Sophomore, so 9th graders are still technically a freshman just still in Junior High School. I think before 9th grade would be good rule, with some outliers like that kid that goes into 9th grade that already has a scholarship and verbal commitment to LSU or something for football and is like 6'2" as a 14 year old....in that minimal occurrence I think we would make an exception!
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Earl



Joined: 10 Nov 2009
Posts: 66

PostPosted: Thu, 01.16.14 4:58 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

Was she 18 in Nooga for the Naked pretzel Shawn Adams Tourney? Still got that video?
Monster wrote:
tease wrote:
League is what hooked me. Lookin' at all dat hot aaaaaaass to tap.


I also remember when you were 18.
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Cam Wow



Joined: 26 Jan 2009
Posts: 369
Location: Faytown

PostPosted: Thu, 01.16.14 6:30 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

I want to thank the schedule maker for giving my team a 3rd round bye! I get to watch the end of Broncos Pats game!!!
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ROCOBaller



Joined: 22 Sep 2005
Posts: 2079
Location: your mom's house

PostPosted: Thu, 01.16.14 7:15 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

I think the biggest advantage all you dudes have in wanting the girls to come out, have fun and come back is so that we can be divided among more teams. It has to suck whenever we have enough guys signed up to have 10+ teams but only enough ladies for 8. So then you get put on bigger teams and get less PT.

I agree with Chuck's statements also that we need to recognize that we should be reaching out to new male players and involve them also, but girls rule and boyz drool...(j/k)

In conclusion, I started playing ultimate in leagues (I was way too old for college at that point), and the last time Hayride existed was 2010.
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tease



Joined: 19 Aug 2005
Posts: 1418
Location: in your kitchen

PostPosted: Thu, 01.16.14 9:52 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

Earl. Even after all these years, that video is still on Scotty been rounds camera. I believe he showed it to me at GRUB this year.
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Elvin



Joined: 17 Apr 2008
Posts: 1246
Location: The Science Department's big Oppenheimer Pinata Party

PostPosted: Thu, 01.16.14 10:03 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

kdoe wrote:
I think Jody counts Aidan(sp?) as a girl as well.


I'm pretty sure that's more of a statement on gender roles than it is an ultimate thing.
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