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joyness



Joined: 07 Apr 2003
Posts: 2138
Location: Fayettenam

PostPosted: Thu, 02.19.09 2:33 pm    Post subject: What hooks people on ultimate? Reply with quote

fluffy wrote:
What I want to see is more than 10-15% of the players continuing to play (pickup & tournaments) after leagues.

What does it take to get someone hooked?
For me, it was the sport ~ which is a non-contact, gender neutral, athletic, strategic, frisbee chasing fun thing!


Rather than keep this viable relevant topic buried in the Week 5 thread, I thought it might be something worth real consideration.

There's has been talk of all the new faces at league this winter.
How did they get to league?
What is needed to keep them playing?

Would a "Skills" clinic, where they could learn more about throws, techniques, and strategy, be of interest to the new players?
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RandomHero



Joined: 09 Nov 2004
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PostPosted: Thu, 02.19.09 2:53 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

beer....

and pussy...

preferably at the same time.
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evan mcb



Joined: 05 Apr 2004
Posts: 1951

PostPosted: Thu, 02.19.09 3:08 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

RandomHero wrote:
beer....

and pussy...

preferably at the same time.


Oh shit is that even possible?! XD
Keep reaching for the moon, man!
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turk



Joined: 16 Aug 2007
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PostPosted: Thu, 02.19.09 3:45 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

I talked to the girl I brought out to league for the first time and she said she really enjoyed it because she learned a lot and got a good amount of playing time. Since there aren't a whole lot of new players on the boards, maybe captains could have them fill out a survey at the end of league?
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Supafunky



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PostPosted: Thu, 02.19.09 8:58 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

Turk, I think a survey is a great idea.

There is some amount of evidence right in front of us. 150-200 people play in league almost every Sunday. 20 people show up for any given pick-up.

hmmm. Maybe we need more leagues.
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Joel
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PostPosted: Thu, 02.19.09 9:42 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

Supafunky wrote:
Turk, I think a survey is a great idea.

There is some amount of evidence right in front of us. 150-200 people play in league almost every Sunday. 20 people show up for any given pick-up.

hmmm. Maybe we need more leagues.


I think a short fall league between harvest and xmas would be a fantastic idea. also maybe a beginers / fun league that runs at the same time as ada.
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ROCOBaller



Joined: 22 Sep 2005
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PostPosted: Fri, 02.20.09 7:36 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

i agree, but think we need a spring league

i think you really just have to find a way to make someone like the sport enough to want to give up their free time playing it. newbies do that for winter league, but most don't start coming out to pick up...perhaps, another league soon after winter league would get them to continue to play, and then that would instill a desire to improve, which could bring them out to pick up.


(but really, i don't think we should try to grow the numbers anymore. think how long the thread is going to be about the winter league tournament when there are 14 + teams. j/k y'allz)
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LDoc



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PostPosted: Fri, 02.20.09 9:53 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

Between Winter League, Summer League and ADA there's roughly 20 weeks of ultimate leagues a year (I might be off somewhaté─ÂI was thinking that ADA and FDA overlap a little bit).

I'm thinking the closer that number is to 52, the better.
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jwillgoesfast



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PostPosted: Fri, 02.20.09 10:35 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

well, i'm up for 52 weeks of league play in some fashion or another. I guess in FDA, there are roughly 4 types of people:
1) new/beginner/rookies who havent played much
2)players who are always going to tourneys (esp college)
3) people like me and luke (who casey apparently despises) who played a lot in college, love ultimate, but can't travel as much but want to play as much semi-comptetive ultimate as possible, hence where having many leagues comes into play.
4) the average FDAer who has maybe been to a few tourneys, plays most leagues, but is neither a die-hard proponent or rookie.

That being said, i feel like we could quickly reach a saturation point of league... group #1 and #3 would benefit the most, #4 would play but would likely be pushed to the cusp of burn out, I can only imagine a phone call from a captain making sure they show up this week could get old 52 weeks in a row. #2 will be indifferent but their participation will likely drop off in the spring and fall b/c they will be busy with tourneys and practices. if we were constatnly promoting and having leagues, the rookies group #1 would probably either get tired of it and phase themselves out, or would become in love/obsessed with the sport (our hope) and become a die-hard proponent.

That being said, i don't think we should add more leagues for the sake of adding more leagues, (I do think we should add leagues) but they should be niche' leagues, for instance I think Joel's rookie/fun league is a great Idea. we could book-end it with rookie clinics or something. also, we could encourage rookies with leadership skills to get involved that way, which will give them a sense of ownership. This league could go on in the spring. then we could have some sort of other type of niche league in the Fall...not sure on ideas with this one, but perhaps a city vs. city league, all springdale players on one team, all north of springdale players, then divide fayetteville by quadrants, or have college vs. old people vs HS, etc...just brainstorming. we could maybe do another non-coed sort of league, this is a crazy idea, but maybe you could have say instead of a 10 team league, have 5 really big teams with good captains (like jody) then each team plays 2 games at the same time, players can be split between each game according to the captains preference...this idea is out there, just trying to brainstorm...thats about all i got, but i suggest we continue to brainstorm niche' type leagues for the spring and fall, but i really like the idea of a rookie/fun league in the spring.

We can also try to have more mini-impromptu hat tournaments between leagues.

as for the questionnaire we should ask pointed (and not vague) questions such as "if there was a 10week fall leaguing, would you play? and "if there was a 8 week rookie league in the spring would you play, and would you be interested in having a leadership role?"
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ROCOBaller



Joined: 22 Sep 2005
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PostPosted: Fri, 02.20.09 10:59 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

i agree...i wouldn't expect many college players involved in a spring league and so on and so forth
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Katherine



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PostPosted: Fri, 02.20.09 11:05 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

Speaking of niche leagues....


we're at a point right now where we have a lot more guys than gals. I'm totally opposed to another split gender league for that reason. Playing the same three teams over and over again gets old. On the other hand, 6:1 is not really co-ed, and king kharl jokes about making it 6:1 or 7:0, offense chooses, next winter league. At least, I hope that was a joke. JT suggested that we run a guys league concurrently with a co-ed league. This is a niche I believe needs to be addressed. If we want more women to play, we need to make it fun for them. Both of the current formats (all women's league with four savage teams and "co-ed" with one spot for a woman on the line) marginalize women. If we ran a guys league at the same time, we could play 5:2, 4:3 offense chooses, and make women more central to the league. We get enough of "em hooked and then the split gender thing works.
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Rohde



Joined: 18 May 2007
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PostPosted: Fri, 02.20.09 11:25 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

Maybe this is kind of what has been said already but I'm going to act like it isn't. So I know there are probably 3 different types of men players.
1. Hates playing with women
2. The impartial
3. Loves Co-ed

What could happen is a men's league and a co-ed league going on at the same time. The 2's can be split and 1 and 3 can have their league. Both these leagues would be semi-competitive. (not ADA style) The problems I could see with this is adequate numbers, drafting, evenly matched teams.

I personally could use another league of some kind. I like being part of a functioning team and since I'm not in college anymore I dont really have that.
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jwillgoesfast



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PostPosted: Fri, 02.20.09 12:00 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

Kat and R-dogg, i think you are both making the same point, and I also like that idea. If Kats feelings are indicative of most of the women players, then having an all guys and a co-ed (with higher women ratios) league at the same time is definitely a good way to go.

Since we're making lists and stereotyping ultimate players, here's another one:

1) super competitive, always likes to win and be first and get recognition of such achievements.
2) likes competition and recognition, but not overly so.
3) hate all of these aforementioned things.

with this in mind, perhaps we could have some sort of "pickup league" on 1 of the 2 pickup nights. where we keep a tally on the boards of who goes to pickup and who wins the pickup games, then they get scored and ranked by how many pickup games they have been on the winning team of. maybe this would take too much effort, but we all know how king kharl loves lists and checking them twice. the stats could also help with league drafting, etc...just another hair brained jwill idea i suppose.
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Joel
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PostPosted: Fri, 02.20.09 12:57 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

april: a spring league would be scrumtralescent, but i would think should be less of a priority than college:
1) it would have to start really close to the end of winter league
2) would have almost no college players
3) pickup already has good numbers during those months.

jwill: 8-10 weeks is probably too long. I think the FDA would be over extending itself if it tries to put on a league that starts during the lead up to harvest. I'd say start small with a 4 team round robin and a 2 round tourney on the 4th week. make it a hat league if you don't want to mess with captains / draft. make this your mission. super easy. see what it grows to from there.

rhode/kat: I think your ideas could work if you let the guys sign up as 1,2, or 3s. that way you can shuffle the 2s around based on how to make the numbers work. also if you are going to do a league specifically for mixed, make it 4:3 3:4 this is what the upa does, and it really makes a big difference in terms of it being really hard to marginalize the women on the team.

new interesting option: 4:3 3:4 coed league where teams choose themselves with a roster cap of 10. have it during ADA instead of the women's division. add some kind of recruitment requirement / pt requirement for new players if you want to make it more about that.
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ROCOBaller



Joined: 22 Sep 2005
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PostPosted: Fri, 02.20.09 1:46 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

i don't like the idea of a concurrent men's only league during a co-ed league b/c all the mens i want to play with don't like playing with women as much

i know king kharl has something in mind for springtime, and i wouldn't expect much involvement from the college kids, but that's scrumtralescent...this is an excellent time to coddle the new players


i think we definitely need to plan a local tourney some weekend this spring not too far away from winter league...april 4th looks good, perhaps fayetteville's own fool's fest

i do like the idea of a co-ed ada, but i don't see ajax changing that, which is his right to not do so. i totally love the new interesting option joel, but when could we have it? probably not the same time as ada. kat is right, there are not enough women to have a competitive women's only league in the area...there is barely enough to have a 3 team women only league...i'm toying with the idea of making the WDA become a mini-hat tourney each week instead of dividing into set teams, so we can mix it up...each girl would get a white and a dark, but there's plenty of time to ponder and work out details. i'm really hoping we have enough ladies for 4 teams if this new interesting option doesn't fly.
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